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	<title>Comments on: A Second Look: Apple Windows Updater, Safari 3.1, and You.</title>
	<atom:link href="http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/</link>
	<description>Posts from an Internet island...</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 22:12:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1019</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Mar 2008 07:02:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1019</guid>
		<description>I hope those of you saying 'this is war, apple has to do what they did' etc, blah blah blah, never write any software. If you do, please let me know in advance so I'll know what POS not to purchase. Thanks.

The customer needs to be able to trust that a company is not going to, nor appear to try to, pull a fast one on them and trick them into using products of theirs other than the ones they've already opted for. It really IS that simple.

I know how to get other Apple hardware/software if I need it. Maybe they should let me make my own choices without annoying ways of "helping" me.

And yes, this is being typed on a MBP using Safari 3.1 in OS X 10.5.2, and I wouldn't have it any other way.  But I hate "real player" like maneuvers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hope those of you saying &#8216;this is war, apple has to do what they did&#8217; etc, blah blah blah, never write any software. If you do, please let me know in advance so I&#8217;ll know what POS not to purchase. Thanks.</p>
<p>The customer needs to be able to trust that a company is not going to, nor appear to try to, pull a fast one on them and trick them into using products of theirs other than the ones they&#8217;ve already opted for. It really IS that simple.</p>
<p>I know how to get other Apple hardware/software if I need it. Maybe they should let me make my own choices without annoying ways of &#8220;helping&#8221; me.</p>
<p>And yes, this is being typed on a MBP using Safari 3.1 in OS X 10.5.2, and I wouldn&#8217;t have it any other way.  But I hate &#8220;real player&#8221; like maneuvers.</p>
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		<title>By: zato</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1008</link>
		<dc:creator>zato</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Mar 2008 00:04:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1008</guid>
		<description>There should be quotes around the first sentence just above.

Also, James Katt wrote:  "This is a war against Microsoft using similar tactics but far more honorable than Microsoft!"

Yes, and the software is pretty good too. This is war, Apple has been stepping up the fight a step at a time. Whatever you do in this world, someone will oppose you. The bigger the thing you do, the greater the opposition, or the more they make you pay. You have to pay to make gains.

Soon China and India will be the largest computer markets. Microsoft rules in these countries now because PC's are cheap and Macs are expensive in these countries.. Apple strategy must also include these markets. Having 10 or even 30% of the US market won't mean much 5 years from now. The software is the real battleground, and there Apple can compete.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There should be quotes around the first sentence just above.</p>
<p>Also, James Katt wrote:  &#8220;This is a war against Microsoft using similar tactics but far more honorable than Microsoft!&#8221;</p>
<p>Yes, and the software is pretty good too. This is war, Apple has been stepping up the fight a step at a time. Whatever you do in this world, someone will oppose you. The bigger the thing you do, the greater the opposition, or the more they make you pay. You have to pay to make gains.</p>
<p>Soon China and India will be the largest computer markets. Microsoft rules in these countries now because PC&#8217;s are cheap and Macs are expensive in these countries.. Apple strategy must also include these markets. Having 10 or even 30% of the US market won&#8217;t mean much 5 years from now. The software is the real battleground, and there Apple can compete.</p>
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		<title>By: zato</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1006</link>
		<dc:creator>zato</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 23:34:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1006</guid>
		<description>Many Apple-bashers are pretty pissed off, though. I mentioned a few of them in this post.

Bashers are going to bash no matter what Apple does.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Many Apple-bashers are pretty pissed off, though. I mentioned a few of them in this post.</p>
<p>Bashers are going to bash no matter what Apple does.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1004</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 18:37:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1004</guid>
		<description>Al,

Yours is the first report I've seen that the suggested "update" is NOT occurring. I'm very curious why your system did not prompt to install Safari. 

"...but I can’t see many being pissed off about more free, excellent software from Apple."

Yet the fact remains that many people are. I'm not pissed about it, though I don't agree with how Apple is doing it. Many Apple-bashers are pretty pissed off, though. I mentioned a few of them in this post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Al,</p>
<p>Yours is the first report I&#8217;ve seen that the suggested &#8220;update&#8221; is NOT occurring. I&#8217;m very curious why your system did not prompt to install Safari. </p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;but I can’t see many being pissed off about more free, excellent software from Apple.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yet the fact remains that many people are. I&#8217;m not pissed about it, though I don&#8217;t agree with how Apple is doing it. Many Apple-bashers are pretty pissed off, though. I mentioned a few of them in this post.</p>
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		<title>By: Al</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1003</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 17:32:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1003</guid>
		<description>OK, I'll take your word for it that Apple is sending Safari For Windows out with regular updates to iTunes on Windows although you couldn't prove it by my experience.

So Apple is sending out a great browser, written by Apple, to users of Apple software on Windows who, for the most part, are very pleased with any Apple software they have ever used. Chances are they will be curious about this browser from Apple and want to try it out. They will use it, or not, but I can't see many being pissed off about more free, excellent software from Apple.

You worry too much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, I&#8217;ll take your word for it that Apple is sending Safari For Windows out with regular updates to iTunes on Windows although you couldn&#8217;t prove it by my experience.</p>
<p>So Apple is sending out a great browser, written by Apple, to users of Apple software on Windows who, for the most part, are very pleased with any Apple software they have ever used. Chances are they will be curious about this browser from Apple and want to try it out. They will use it, or not, but I can&#8217;t see many being pissed off about more free, excellent software from Apple.</p>
<p>You worry too much.</p>
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		<title>By: Granville Kennedy</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1002</link>
		<dc:creator>Granville Kennedy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 16:29:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1002</guid>
		<description>I think Apple may believe that Safari is a necessary update for IE on Windoze.  No harm, no foul.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Apple may believe that Safari is a necessary update for IE on Windoze.  No harm, no foul.</p>
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		<title>By: James Katt</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-1001</link>
		<dc:creator>James Katt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 15:30:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-1001</guid>
		<description>On Windows PCs, Apple has to fight fire with fire.  And it does it not in the background without user choice like Microsoft.

If you want to break the Windows monopoly, I think Apple's technique is fantastic.  Mozilla's CEO is just jealous and is expressing sour hypocritical grapes because he should have thought of this in the first place.

Go Apple!
Booyah!

This is a war against Microsoft using similar tactics but far more honorable than Microsoft!

You cannot fight Microsoft passively.  This rams Safari down Internet Explorer's throat.

I applaud Apple for what it is doing.

Go Apple!
Booyah!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On Windows PCs, Apple has to fight fire with fire.  And it does it not in the background without user choice like Microsoft.</p>
<p>If you want to break the Windows monopoly, I think Apple&#8217;s technique is fantastic.  Mozilla&#8217;s CEO is just jealous and is expressing sour hypocritical grapes because he should have thought of this in the first place.</p>
<p>Go Apple!<br />
Booyah!</p>
<p>This is a war against Microsoft using similar tactics but far more honorable than Microsoft!</p>
<p>You cannot fight Microsoft passively.  This rams Safari down Internet Explorer&#8217;s throat.</p>
<p>I applaud Apple for what it is doing.</p>
<p>Go Apple!<br />
Booyah!</p>
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		<title>By: zato</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-998</link>
		<dc:creator>zato</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 09:53:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-998</guid>
		<description>Nice guys finish last. Apple is now being yang-aggressive. Go Apple!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice guys finish last. Apple is now being yang-aggressive. Go Apple!</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-996</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 06:53:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-996</guid>
		<description>Al,

As you've discovered, GETTING the browser is not a bad thing at all. I've been running Safari on XP since the first beta -- writing a two-part review at the time -- and like it a lot. I've been running the final version this week and it could very well unseat FireFox as my browser of choice on XP. 

Getting Safari is not the issue. The issue is HOW you get it. Actively seeking it out as you did is great. Would that all Windows XP users actively try a different browser than IE! If they did, Microsoft's browser share would probably shrink to 20%. However, most users don't do that. 

Clearly, Apple wants to make it much easier than an "active seek" to get Safari. I'm all for that. But I took issue with a process where the user's led to believe he's installing needed updates when in reality he's installing a new app. 

So am I "right" or "wrong" (yes, the question's rhetorical)? Should Apple have done this or not? If not, what should they have done instead? Well, those are the questions surrounding this debate, aren't they? :) 

The one thing not in question (to me, anyway) was the Safari browser itself. I think it's much better than IE 6 or 7 and, depending on your browsing needs and habits, fully capable of giving FireFox a run for its money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Al,</p>
<p>As you&#8217;ve discovered, GETTING the browser is not a bad thing at all. I&#8217;ve been running Safari on XP since the first beta &#8212; writing a two-part review at the time &#8212; and like it a lot. I&#8217;ve been running the final version this week and it could very well unseat FireFox as my browser of choice on XP. </p>
<p>Getting Safari is not the issue. The issue is HOW you get it. Actively seeking it out as you did is great. Would that all Windows XP users actively try a different browser than IE! If they did, Microsoft&#8217;s browser share would probably shrink to 20%. However, most users don&#8217;t do that. </p>
<p>Clearly, Apple wants to make it much easier than an &#8220;active seek&#8221; to get Safari. I&#8217;m all for that. But I took issue with a process where the user&#8217;s led to believe he&#8217;s installing needed updates when in reality he&#8217;s installing a new app. </p>
<p>So am I &#8220;right&#8221; or &#8220;wrong&#8221; (yes, the question&#8217;s rhetorical)? Should Apple have done this or not? If not, what should they have done instead? Well, those are the questions surrounding this debate, aren&#8217;t they? :) </p>
<p>The one thing not in question (to me, anyway) was the Safari browser itself. I think it&#8217;s much better than IE 6 or 7 and, depending on your browsing needs and habits, fully capable of giving FireFox a run for its money.</p>
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		<title>By: Al</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-995</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 06:19:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-995</guid>
		<description>I just updated iTunes on my XP laptop. I knew it was not the latest version but I did it in order to get Safari on my XP laptop. Well, the updater updated iTunes and Quicktime but there was no Safari or even an option to add Safari while downloading the other programs. I had to go to Apple's site to find where to download Safari For Windows.

It sure blows away IE7. Very fast. Built in spell checker too!

How is getting this excellent browser on my sorry Windows XP laptop a bad thing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just updated iTunes on my XP laptop. I knew it was not the latest version but I did it in order to get Safari on my XP laptop. Well, the updater updated iTunes and Quicktime but there was no Safari or even an option to add Safari while downloading the other programs. I had to go to Apple&#8217;s site to find where to download Safari For Windows.</p>
<p>It sure blows away IE7. Very fast. Built in spell checker too!</p>
<p>How is getting this excellent browser on my sorry Windows XP laptop a bad thing?</p>
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		<title>By: Luis Masanti</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-993</link>
		<dc:creator>Luis Masanti</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 02:14:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-993</guid>
		<description>I re-read the June article and something become clear to me.
As you stated, it is more probable that "someone that already tasted another browser will taste the new one".
But here, we are in another world: the people that update iTunes/QuickTime come to Apple thru the iPod... so they are getting a whole new group of people. Once again, as you said, Apple did a magnificent job on marketing.
The only thing that they missed is to change the name of the app to "Installer and Updater"!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I re-read the June article and something become clear to me.<br />
As you stated, it is more probable that &#8220;someone that already tasted another browser will taste the new one&#8221;.<br />
But here, we are in another world: the people that update iTunes/QuickTime come to Apple thru the iPod&#8230; so they are getting a whole new group of people. Once again, as you said, Apple did a magnificent job on marketing.<br />
The only thing that they missed is to change the name of the app to &#8220;Installer and Updater&#8221;!</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://thesmallwave.com/2008/03/22/a-second-look-apple-windows-updater-safari-31-and-you/#comment-991</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 01:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesmallwave.wordpress.com/?p=510#comment-991</guid>
		<description>I say, so what? If someone was "tricked" into installing Safari, then Apple loses a little cred and the user uninstalls it. Microsoft pushes lot of crap the user can't uninstall and probably doesn't know what was installed. Safari is just an app; what MSFT installs is...well...who knows? Updates, WGA, more secret updates, and the list goes on. And some times it is forced on Windows users. I can't tell you how many times my PC at work has been rebooted after I specifically said I wanted to be asked about updates before installing them.

I see this as a non-issue. Microsofties just want to talk about everything Apple does wrong, in their eyes, right now. The show is not all about MSFT anymore, and they don't know how to handle things when someone else is successful. Apple is making an end around in the Enterprise and they are going to ruffle some feathers along the way. So what. It's still a drop compared to the river of indecency that is still flowing out of Redmond. How many lawsuits and fines does a company have to endure until the public wakes up and realizes just how bad they are? 

I don't mean to turn this into an Apple vs. MSFT debate, but that's what it has become. And the changing of the guard is happening, albeit very slowly. MSFT is standing flat-footed while someone else is eating their lunch. And Windows fans don't know how to take it. They see what Apple is doing and cry foul, while MSFT has been doing it to them all along. 

I guess it's OK when you are a monopoly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I say, so what? If someone was &#8220;tricked&#8221; into installing Safari, then Apple loses a little cred and the user uninstalls it. Microsoft pushes lot of crap the user can&#8217;t uninstall and probably doesn&#8217;t know what was installed. Safari is just an app; what MSFT installs is&#8230;well&#8230;who knows? Updates, WGA, more secret updates, and the list goes on. And some times it is forced on Windows users. I can&#8217;t tell you how many times my PC at work has been rebooted after I specifically said I wanted to be asked about updates before installing them.</p>
<p>I see this as a non-issue. Microsofties just want to talk about everything Apple does wrong, in their eyes, right now. The show is not all about MSFT anymore, and they don&#8217;t know how to handle things when someone else is successful. Apple is making an end around in the Enterprise and they are going to ruffle some feathers along the way. So what. It&#8217;s still a drop compared to the river of indecency that is still flowing out of Redmond. How many lawsuits and fines does a company have to endure until the public wakes up and realizes just how bad they are? </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t mean to turn this into an Apple vs. MSFT debate, but that&#8217;s what it has become. And the changing of the guard is happening, albeit very slowly. MSFT is standing flat-footed while someone else is eating their lunch. And Windows fans don&#8217;t know how to take it. They see what Apple is doing and cry foul, while MSFT has been doing it to them all along. </p>
<p>I guess it&#8217;s OK when you are a monopoly.</p>
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